类型: IC
作者: jal
发布时间: 2017-01-20
21:00:17
更新时间: 2017-02-14 20:20:48
原链接:
https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=87127.0
Update 2017.02.14: I haven’t found a better
price anywhere. I’ll be writing up the GB text, watch for it
as soon as I figure out whatever has to happen to be posted
in the GB section.
Update 2017.02.12:
So, I talked to Digikey. No further price breaks, even at
25k pieces. I’ll be doing some further poking around
tonight, but I think the assumption at this point is that
this is final pricing.
If you know of another source we
should look in to, please let me know ASAP. Otherwise, we’ll
become a group buy and go with this.
Update 2017.02.12: Numbers from Digikey are in. They didn’t offer any
further per-piece discount on on order of 20,000: $.21220
and $.09408 on 8134-HC-8P2 and 9-1437514-0, respectively, is
what they’re offering. I will call them on Monday to see if
there’s a price break around there somewhere, and also to
push forward the questions about packaging, which they
ignored. Either way, once that’s done I’ll convert this to a
GB and we will be off.
Update 2017.02.09: There is no
update. There will be one very soon.
Update 2017.02.03: Asking DK for a quote, and also exploring a possible
alternative. The count is now at least 15,000 of each; I’m
also going to ask for a figure on 20k, but doubt that will
move the needle much on price.
Nothing is settled. If you’re interested,
please fill out the form. We’ll likely become a GB next
week.
Also, looking at people’s responses, the switch
sockets will be gold. If you want lead, cinviloq is selling
batches on MM:
https://www.reddit.com/r/mechmarket/comments/5ricz8/usny_h_holtite_sockets_for_hot_swap_switches_w/
. Naturally, I don’t want to drain off demand here, but not
everyone wants gold.
Update 2017.02.02: I’m waiting on one response I think will be coming, and
then I’m going to take the numbers to Digikey. If you
haven’t yet, please fill out the form.
Current numbers,
not counting my own or the other largish one I’m
expecting:
Switch sockets: 2850, gold is folks’ clear
preference.
LED sockets: 2550, lead/tin is
currently more popular by one vote.
Update 2017.01.29: Interest check form for your form-filling pleasure:
⤋⤋⤋⤋⤋⤋⤋⤋⤋
⟾
Express yourself. ⟽
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Holtite IC
Howdy, folks.
Im curious to find out if we can make it worthwhile to order
a big pile of Holtite sockets.
First up, if you have no
idea what Im talking about, but want to, please read the
next section. If you have no idea what Im talking about and
want to keep it that way, Im unclear on why youre still
reading. Otherwise, you can skip the next section.
What
the…?
You stick them in the holes of your PCB, and then can
seat switches without soldering. This makes the switches
removable, so you can change them without desoldering. A
different model exists that is the correct size for LEDs.
I see some people misspelling them as hotlites, too.
There is a video over at /r/mk on seating them:
https://www.reddit.com/r/MechanicalKeyboards/comments/5a399o/guide_how_to_make_your_pcb_hotswappable/
Also, some folks over there have created a
spreadsheet to keep track of PCBs for which these work and
for which they dont:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1K1qt70E2mcuaHBXYrpPHXlpl7FNaXLo0u_TOe67cVdY/pubhtml?gid=986897710&single=true
Application spec for sockets:
http://www.te.com/commerce/DocumentDelivery/DDEController?Action=srchrtrv&DocNm=114-13033&DocType=SS&DocLang=EN
Ways in which these don’t work
Generally, it
seems they work better on Korean-designed PCBs. The
important part is that they are not guaranteed to work on
just any old board. Your milage is likely to vary.
Another
point is that, especially on the bottom row, alternate
layout accomodations frequently end up resulting in cramped
PCBs, with some through-holes being odd shapes or really
tiny. You cant use these there, and will have to solder
those, depending on your exact layout/PCB combo. Also,
also, sometimes through-holes overlap, so there isn’t enough
surrounding material in which to seat these. Sometimes that
can be overcome by soldering them.
In my very limited
experience, sometimes pulling a switch will also pull the
socket. Ive experienced no PCB damage from this, but I have
lost a couple that went flying. This could be that I didnt
seat them well enough, but I suspect it is just the nature
of the beast - through-hole sizes vary.
There is an
associated tool sold for seating these. It costs over $300,
and I have not used it or even seen it in person. The
soldering-iron method described in the video above works for
me.
The takeaway here is that they aren’t magic,
designed for this particular application, or suitable for
every PCB.
Motivation
My first experiment with
Holtites to facilitate hotswappable switches went fairly
well, and I imagine Im going to be using quite a bit more
over the next year. In fact, I ordered more last week. The
price points are annoying; theyre spendy in quantities
suitable for a single board, and the volume price breaks
make a serious difference, but at quantities that are absurd
for anyone who isnt mass-producing boards for a living.
That
naturally suggests a group buy. Below are details on what
Ive worked out, and some questions for those who would be
interested in going in on this. But before that, a word
about me.
This would be my first group buy. Im
relatively new in these parts, but I like to think have been
a decent citizen in our conversations, and Ive been a fairly
active participant in others buys. On the plus side, I am a
very good imitation of a responsible adult, have run a
company in the past and worked for myself for over a decade,
so I’m pretty confident in my ability to handle the
logistics, accounting, communications and whatnot. While Im
new here, Ive been actively online since the early 90s under
my real name, and have many, many reasons not to poison
that. If something with the group buy somehow went massively
pear-shaped, I am sufficiently financially stable to spend
my way out of any mistakes I make, and will make sure that
everyone who takes part ends up whole. All of that said, I
wouldnt fault anyone here for not extending trust.
My
goals are to stockpile a fair pile for myself at a decent
price, and will not mark anything up. Depending on demand,
Im considering investing in an additional little pile of
these and selling those at a markup at my own store, but
that may or may not happen. Either way, I intend to keep
this entirely transparent, with the costs public and
early-and-often communication as it proceeds, if it
proceeds.
Now that that’s out of the way
People
are calling two different pin sockets Holtites (after the
series name): receptacles for switches, and for LEDs.
For
the switch sockets, there are two choices: gold or
tin/lead. Gold is of course more expensive, and for our
purposes, entirely cosmetic.
For the LED sockets,
Digikey requires a large (50K) minimum order, and their
pricing is significantly worse than Mouser. Unfortunately,
Mouser is backordered, estimating nine weeks lead-time. But
for a group buy, that perhaps works out OK. I have some on
backorder there, mainly to see if that 9-week figure is real
- sometimes it isn’t. Ive only found them in lead - as far
as I know, there is no gold option made.
Pricing:
Starting
at 2500 pieces, the lead switch sockets cost $0.1559 each,
the gold, $0.2122. I have not yet asked for quotes on larger
orders, pending getting an idea from you all about what sort
of volume were actually talking about.
Lead (
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/8134-HC-8P3/A114359-ND/1151726):
Gold (
http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/te-connectivity-amp-connectors/8134-HC-8P2/A114358-ND/2188091):
For the LED sockets, Mouser sells them for $.084 each
in lots of 5000. at 50K, the cost is $.079/ea.
The
second-worst thing I can imagine happening here is getting a
some huge number of these in one big bag, and subsequently
spending the next three years of my life counting them out.
Im going to ask Digikey and Mouser about possible options
there, but the recent order I made of 1000 came in 10
100-count bags, so if that holds for larger orders (and if
custom-count bagging is too expensive) I think these will be
purchased and delivered in 100-count increments.
As a bit of anecdata, my first order of these was for
250, and I ran out socketing a TKL with a numpad. I think I
lost four and ruined another two installing them.
So,
questions:
- Interested?
- Unless we end up looking at insane volume, it would be best to pick either tin/lead or gold, so we can maximize the volume discount. Im thinking gold, because it seems to me that people like that sort of thing, but Im frequently wrong. What are your preferences?
- I have the impression that the LED sockets will be less popular. SIP sockets are a reasonable substitute in many situations, and anyway, lots of people dont care about LEDs. OTOH, if youre already committed to this insanity, my thought is if the board might ever end up in the hands of someone who likes the blinkenlights, they arent comparatively a huge additional expense; may as well socket it all up. So the question is, assuming youre in for a packet of switch sockets, would you also go for the LED sockets?
-
Mr. T vs. Mothra: who wins?
